The Myth of the Young Progressive Christian

Word has it there is a new wave of progressivism among young Christians.  Supposedly, this new group cares about social issues other than abortion or homosexuality.  Many of them want to distance themselves from the Religious Right and instead focus of issues of justice, peace, poverty and the environment.  From what I hear, some of them even want to rethink some basic theological concepts such as the atonement, biblical inerrancy and eschatology.

I would love to sit down and talk with one of these new young progressive Christians.  Like them, I believe there is an alternative path to either conservative evangelicalism or atheism. I would like to think my church is a safe space that welcomes them to explore following Jesus on a deeper level.  The only problem is, I have never encountered one. 

Don’t get me wrong, as I travel and attend conferences, I encounter these young progressive Christians in other parts of the country.  But here in Orange County, NY, most of the under 35 year-olds who check out our church, seem to basically be looking for Saddleback East.

Granted, our area has few people under 35, since the cost of living is high and entry-level employment opportunities low.  So our sample size may not be large enough to draw any conclusions.  Also, I should point out, our church does have many people under the age of 35 who love Vision.  However, few of them resemble the graphic-tee-thick-rimmed-glasses character one encounters in literature about ministry.

Since Vision began eight years ago, I have been astounded by the disconnect between what I read younger generations are looking for in a church, and what many actually gravitate toward.  Although I read that they (forgive my use of the word “they) value authentic community and friendship, I find many are hesitant to commit to a community.  For years I’ve heard that younger generations aren’t looking for a church of programs, but one of relationships.  Yet most under-35’s around here still pick their church based on the size of its children and family programs. Supposedly these new progressives want to rethink some ideas about their faith.  Many even tell me how much they like Rob Bell and Donald Miller.  Yet, any sermon I preach that is the least bit theologically challenging, sends them running to the nearest Willow Creek clone.  More often than not, they seem to be as fearful of new ideas and as rigid in their theology as the stereotypical cane-wielding old church lady.  Ironically, I have a 95 year-old woman in our church who is more open-minded than those a third of her age.

Perhaps it is because we are located in an area of the US where few people even go to church anymore.  Maybe the only under-35 churchgoers around here are the last die-hard holdouts and as such are looking for that old time religion.   The many other under-35’s I do know have no use for church.  Contrary to Dan Kimball's book, they don’t even like Jesus. They would describe themselves as atheists and no amount of candles, meditation, Taize or dialogue will ever convince them to be otherwise.

My intent here is not to criticize anyone in that age group who is looking for something different than what Vision offers.  I only want to point out that much of we pastors read and accept as orthodoxy about the spirituality of younger generations, does not match what many of us actually encounter in real world ministry.

Is it possible that much of the expertise we hear in conferences and read in books is merely drawn from other books and conferences, and not from actual experience? Those of you who are under 35, do you feel you have been stereotyped as to what you are looking for in a church?  How many of you out there have experienced this in your ministry? 

Comments

[Dan]

Hey Don!

A couple of thoughts..

At least in my writings, it is ALL based out of actual experiences with people outside the church and the book has the quotes from the people. Zondervan then filmed a DVD where they and others were interviewed - so it is for sure based out of real life experiences, not just theory from conferences.

I'd read Ed Stetzer's book "Lost and Found" as he interviewed over 1,000 young adults in USA and Canada and got similar results.

Generally young adults outside the church don't know Christian authors - or look to churches. So I would be interested in exploring more of the specific backgrounds of those you describe. Did they grow up in a church and then return looking for something for their kids etc.?

I grew up in northern New Jersey and know up where you are is not an easy place by any means to be a church on mission. Probably one of the toughest places in the USA in my opinion. So may God bless your efforts and ministry there!

Dan

[Don Heatley]

Hi Dan,
Thanks for your comments. I am a great admirer of your work. I know your book was based on actual experiences. When "They Like Jesus but Not the Church" came out, I saw it as a sign of hope. But unfortunately, most of the young adults I encounter outside the church like neither. As for many who visit our church for a time, they seem more comfortable with fairly traditional forms of church, theology and worship.

It's just that, as you said, this part of the country is very different and I often wonder if I am doing ministry on the same planet as many other pastors. Actually your books have been a great help to us. Believe it or not, many of the ideas in them have resonated more with an older contingent in our community. As I mentioned, Vision does have young adults who love our church, but they are not as common as those who do not.

Regarding backgrounds, many of the young adults I referred to in the post were from Roman Catholic or Evangelical backgrounds. Yes, in some cases they are returning and looking for something for their kids, but in many instances they are couples without children. Sometimes they share with me their criticisms of churches in general (e.g. how it treats women or gays). When I assure them Vision isn't like that, they often respond, not in relief, but almost in annoyance that I have taken away their reason to be critical of church. Or they suddenly act as if we are too liberal and go away. Very strange. Someone needs to write a book about ministry with young adults in the Northeast.

So I grew up in Wayne, where did you? I also used to produce and edit videos for Zondervan. Too bad we didn't get a chance to work together.

Thanks for adding your voice here.
Peace,
Don

[Danny Bixby]

I'm 27. I'd say you have a bad sampling.

First, excuse me, I know nothing of you or your church except from what is presented in this article, so please don't take my statements to be more than a first glance reaction to your post from an uninformed visitor.

It's a shame you don't have young progressives/missionals/emergents/"whatever other buzz phrase exists to describe us" where you are.

Perhaps you are doing all you can to reach people of my age bracket, to get progressive young adults into your church. But, perhaps you are not. Perhaps you're going about it wrong.

Or perhaps you're doing everything exactly right. I can't say. I do like your post. I like what you present. And your perceptions could be entirely correct of your area.

As for your question, I do not feel I've been stereotyped as to what I'm looking for in a church. I knew what I was looking for long before I had even heard the terms missional or emergent; when the word "progressive" was little more than profanity from the lips of an evangelical.

I didn't know where to find it. I didn't know it could exist. I stumbled onto it by no other explanation than God blessing me and my family.

I've since discovered a world of people my age who feel what I feel, desire what I desire from life, faith, church, community and mission. And who can actually communicate with me effectively. Who understand me. Who I can identify with.

I feel that I am the exact description of what you have defined as the young progressive Christian. And it is indeed precisely what I've been looking for.

Take care.

[Jesse]

I appreciate the honesty and the questions in this post. Great writing, and I applaud your genuine efforts. I can only speak from my experience, and since I would consider myself a "young progressive" or "emergent" I'll toss in my 2 cents.

I am looking for a totally different type of church and community. Unfortunately, what has been offered to me often feels like a bait-and-switch: Hip websites, catch phrases, modern art and talk of "coffee & conversation" lure me in, and then I am face-to-face with the same old "turn or burn" theology that makes me want to wretch. I've had this experience 3 or 4 times in the last two years, which maybe doesn't seem like much, but after each bad experience, it takes me months to gather the courage to return to any church.

Based upon my experience, one guess about what you are seeing is that the young progressives have given up on church altogether. So although you may have a legitimate offer for them (us?), they are not even willing to consider it because they have been tricked and abused so many times before. From my experience, my generation is looked upon more as a valuable demographic for the life and future stability of a church, rather than for my innate God-given value as a person. I'm not interested in contributing to the diversity of a church community or building a young adult program for the next 15 years; I want to find God.

So I rarely go to church. I found an emergent community of other young progressives and we meet when, where and how we want. I find God amongst them and it's been a blessing. And whenever I see advertisements, flyers, banners, etc. for a new "relevant" "young" "socially conscious" church, I just shrug and figure they are trying to use the latest lingo to appeal to my demographic - which feels very inauthentic and is a big "turn off."

Please understand: I'm not saying that your church is trying deceive young adults; like Danny Bixby, I know nothing of your church other than this post. But perhaps the reason young adults aren't coming through your door is that they aren't walking through the doors of any church.

Blessings -

[Don Heatley]

Danny,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. It sounds as if you have found a great faith community. I agree, my experience could just be a bad sampling.
Don

[Don Heatley]

Jesse,
You raise some great points. I too can't stand the bait and switch routine that many churches perform. Vision certainly doesn't. Perhaps that is the problem. In this part of the country, it seems the only young adults who will even check out a church are ones who are looking for a "turn or burn" theology in some form.

Many who visit us seem to pull a bait and switch of their own. They dress cool, seem well-informed about topics like emerging churches, claim to want edgy ideas, but turn out to be sheep in wolves clothing. Often it's only a matter of time before they tell me our church doesn't talk enough about the Rapture or Satan, or someone in their small group doubted that Jesus literally walked on water. I think their notion of an edgy idea is wearing jeans to a women's conference.

I am glad you have found a non-traditional community that allows you be who God calls you to be and do what God calls you to do.
Peace,
Don

[James Townsend]

Hope you find 'em soon, man. We're out there. ;-)

[Paul VanderKlay]

Great post Don! It raised a couple of thoughts for me.

The success tease even for the "authentic" emergent: Read the literature and supposedly there is a large pent-up "market" of persons such as you describe and all you need to do is create this venue, as you describe that embodies this mythical "third way" and they will flock. You rightly expose the gas and "vapor ware" that this is. It is simply an echo of the previous ambition induced enticement of the seeker movement that suggested that if you "create a safe place for people to hear a dangerous message" by replacing the organ with a jazz band, adding a praise team and a positive "how to fix your life/kids/marriage with Jesus" message then "seekers" will flock to your church and you'll be Willow next... Perhaps the emergent movement isn't as "turnkey" an operation as the seeker wasn't either.

I imagine your "sample" is dead on correct because it speaks to human nature and the realities of community. Nobody likes to face the fact that their current reality is "authentic" and that the institutionally-offered "upgrade" they hope to acquire by virtue of identification or attendance whether from the big-box seeker mall down the road or the hipster emergent save-the-world are really the same thing. You are still you whether you buy your coffee at Costco, Starbucks or the locally owned place down the road where the guy swears third world locals get a fair deal. Where you buy your coffee doesn't change your life.

The seeker movement teased by offering transformation on the cheap. The emergent movement has the same potential of offering community on the cheap. Neither transformation nor community can be had on the cheap, it costs us our lives which is exactly what Jesus said it would.

Thank you for speaking the truth and daring to unveil the market and success temptations of every new American wrapping of the church that seduces us into short-changing the basic gospel which is cross first then resurrection. pvk

[Don Heatley]

Hey Paul,
Great comment. Must be the result of going to a great high school :-)
Don

[Spencer Smith]

This is a really good post. I'm glad I found this.

I'm 27, and a UM pastor at a mega church in the South. From my experience, I would either agree with Danny that you have a bad sampling, or perhaps it is just the difference in the spirituality of our geography.

From your post and looking at your website, I'm not sure why you are expecting young adults to come to your church. I don't know your context, but it seems like an attraction based model is just not going to work.

I am a pastor with young adults at an evangelical UM mega-church, and for us we encounter many progressive young adults. What I find most often are people who resonate highly with Kimbal's statement about not liking the church, but liking Jesus. This group seems to be exclusively de-churched in some way (I am in the Bible-belt, so everyone has some exposure to church), and looking for someone who won't have a legalistic, rapture, hell-fire theology.

I will say I agree with you a whole lot in terms of the generalizations that are occurring in most "emergent" writings. I don't think we can find that one model that is going to resonate with everyone. Personally, I think the old ancient-future thing has run its course. I'm not sure yet what is going to replace it, it may very well be traditional worship or it may be the modern worship LifeChurch thing. I can't tell yet.

This is a great critique of the emergent movement, and it is especially nice to hear Methodists talking about young adult ministry in this way. Great post!

[Don Heatley]

Hi Spencer,
Thanks for the great feedback, Yes, it sounds like you are in a different environment than we are. We have the dechurched you described who are looking for an alternative to hell-fire theology - but they tend to be over 35. I'd love to talk to you about the website sometime. I'll contact you directly.
Thanks
Don

[Jenna Murphy]

Here's the repost, as requested.

Hello All, particularly Pastor Don!

I started writing this as a comment on your most recent note on the myth of the young progressive Christian, realized I was saying too much for a comment box and decided to continue the dialogue here.

I was really surprised when I began reading this particular entry, just because I feel like personally, my own spiritual journey takes me to many sides of this debate about the stereotype of the young "progressive" Christian.

I found Vision in my late highschool experience after calling myself a non-denominational Christian for the previous 3 and a half years. I was raised and confirmed in a Roman Catholic Church, only to realize at age 13 that I may not know everything about my faith but I knew enough to admit I'd made a mistake.

The mistake for me was allowing myself to participate in a community of believers who ultimately, independent of their own, sometimes kind and generous or intelligent character, fostered relationships of gossip, malice, closed-mindedness and resentment which I could no longer stand. I found hypocrices in the fold of what I believed and what I gave as an answer on my CCD quizzes. I tried to serve as a lector after school and was told by my priest to "come back when I had a skirt on". I began awakening to my own adolescence and feared the consequences of coming out as bisexual in a room full of people who didn't even like to acknowledge I was born of an unmarried single mother and a black father.

For me, the only time I felt truly in a state of communion with Christ and other believers was the time I spent nearly ever summer at Camp Warwick, where the theology was designed to meet the needs and challenge the heart, mind and soul of all kinds of young people, regardless of their background. We united in lively (read: loud and boisterous) contemporary christian music, reflective worship adressing issues we cared about, and the sheer enjoyment of being a child, slowly learning to take not one moment (or pizza night) for granted.

My point is coming. When I got to highschool, I was conscious of my faith and wanted to seek a community I could identify with. I wanted to commit to something more than just an aimless walk, rarely and reluctantly picking up my Bible and plumbing it for answers I wasn't seeing in the first place. Vision was the answer for me. I found a community that admitted to the truth that no one is perfect but wanted something better for itself and for its congregants. Vision brought up fond memories of jumping up and down and rejoicing in the music and worship of my Lord instead of standing still with an out-of-key Latin choir. And then there was its leadership, between you and Pam overseeing a body of believers that all took part in something greater than themselves and spoke a Word that was controversial and challenging, in the sense that it was exactly what the Word has been all along, no filter.

I was surprised because for all of this I considered myself to be a young, progressive Christian. I was on the run from conservativism and seeking a message and a form of worship that made me feel alive and comfortable. But I've come to the conclusion that this term must be relative in its own right, because I know just the kind of other youths of which you speak (with the exception of the ones in megachurches, I'm not sure I've met a lot of them).

Progressive young Christians, PYC's maybe, are often looking for a faith to fit them, rather than an open and maleable self-will to fit a faith. Committment for any teen is difficult. I myself feel guilty for not giving as much time, energy or tithings as I probably could to Vision, and I am a Covenant Partner. I think I could do better, but sometimes working up the where-with-all to meet these goals is easier said than done (i.e. backburnered).

As far as recieving the message, I can also say that in hearing the Word you give, be it online or in the church, I find myself agreeing with a lot of what you have to say. And when I do feel uncomfortable (which is rare) or challenged it's because I'm hearing something I know is right, but again, have a little too much reluctance (guilt) to be proactive about it at the time.

I'm going out on a limb here, but I have a theory about those youths who retreat to their old coservative habits, megachurch hype and even the atheist-agnostic path. Megachurches for example, build themselves on what outwardly apears to be high-energy massive-numbers of people in worship, led by a singular point-of-view that is popular in that particular community. Conservative habits die hard as I can be living testament to the phenomenon of "Catholic Guilt". And my countless endeavors with atheist and agnostic friends enlighten me about those have chosen a life of assuming nothing and everything, leaving the "giant puzzle of truth" to be filled by everyone(else) and settling for loosely defined "sprituality" as opposed to the dreaded "organized religion". In either case, the commitment's been made for them. They just manifest that commitment in different ways that involve less self-determination or free will as opposed to indoctrination, mob-mentality or going with the flow.
As the cliche says, even if you decide not to choose, you've still made a choice.

As youths, we all know this, we just don't like to admit it sometimes. Sometimes we're too afraid to let go of the past, afraid to be "wrong", and let's be honest, threats of eternal damnation aren't easy to just brush off. I think it takes a great deal of wisdom, strength and love for a person under 35 to make any kind of commitment. And as for me, I'm still trying.

Hope this feedback is useful! See you Sunday!
<3 Peace
Jenna

[Micah]

Wow, this is eerie. I found this through bob's blog, and couldn't agree more with what you're saying. In fact, I wrote something pretty similar in my own (sadly-neglected) blog several months ago.

See what you think:

http://mrodor.blogspot.com/2009/01/random-something-i-wrote.html

[Don Heatley]

Hey Jenna,
Thanks for adding your first-hand perspective on this. One of the observations I was trying to share in my post is that, according to a lot of books about ministry (not just Dan's), I should be encountering young adults like you often and I don't. We're so glad you're a part of church and value all that you bring to our community.
Don

[Don Heatley]

Micah,
I loved your blog post. It seems every 5 years or so we are told we are going through a paradigm shift which no generation has gone through before. I'm sure some "cutting edge" pastor said the same thing was said about CB radio in 1975.
Don

[mike oles]

Hi Don,

thanks for your post. I have been thinking about it for a few days now.

Here in Indianapolis, it seems that most of the younger folks who attend church end up at the more conservative churches that have a good social scene.

I try to ask my friends who go to these churches if they think it is totally crazy that women and men don't have the same rights at these places, but they don't seem to care too much! The few young folks who i do come across who seem progressive are all committed to very regressive places.

Our small church is finnally starting to grow and most of our membership and leadership is under 30 but do have a core group of folks who are in their late 40s.

I think it just takes time and building peeople's trust. Ultimately, there probably isn't a lot of young progressive Christians out there, especially ones that are already deeply committed or deeply uncommitted to a/the church.

But, i think that is why the emergent church is so exciting, because it allows for real transformative conversation to happen... and those conversations help develop progressive christians.

[Tyler]

I think the problem here is that you're looking for these kinds of progressive young Christians inside your church. They aren't at a church. They've been pushed away or at least feel pushed away.

[Matt Kelley]

Clearly you can't fit all members of one generation into a box. That's a good thing.

But if you're wondering, I fit the profile you described. I don't wear square glasses or screen printed T-shirts, but I'm there theologically. We're out there.

[Ben Lemery]

Piggybacking on Tyler's comment but not in anyway a parallel statment, progressive Christians are ideologues just like conservative Christians are. As the saying goes, "birds of a feather flock together."

A young adult progressive is going to be more steered toward a mainline denomination that is gay friendly, socially active; Mars Hill-Grand Rapids; online communities where they can watch at their own leisure; or they simply profess Christ but don't attend church.

Moving out to California from Michigan, the theological points of view that are liberally based are shocking to me. In Michigan, these types of views and thoughts would have been seen as heretical. I think it is regionally based but it is spreading very quickly.

Just my thoughts.

[pb]

it's all about the midwest/north. the stereotypical, mythical, young progressive christian you speak of - they seem to be thriving in churches in places like Wisconsin, Minnesota, and Illinois (not Chicago). Definitely not the east or west coasts where it's either ultra-liberalism VS reactionary fundamentalism. generally speaking, of course... ;)

[Victoria]

I am 25 and church hopped for a few years looking at both progressive churches & whatever this new kind you mentioned is called: progressive?

After about three years of that, I've found myself back at my parents' church: a conservative, tradition AG fellowship. Why? Because I'm tired the only thing going for a church being that it is new or different. I want the Word & Jesus. If I am lookin for "organic" I will head to he nearest Whole Foods.

People my age seem to have no problem tearing the Scriptures apart and essentially throwing portions out, but have almost zero understanding of the text. I can't respect that, so I go to church where at my pastor doesn't try to put a fresh spin on anything & simply challenges the congregation to live righteously.

Great blog!

[Kristin T. (@kt_writes)]

I ended up at your blog via Twitter, thanks to Tyler, who commented above. I was very excited to see your post, because it fits right in with what I posted about today, about a group of 20- and 30-something people at my church who are trying to figure out what we can do to help the homeless population in our small city.

In my experience (which isn't necessarily the norm, because I live in a university town and am a part of a social justice-focused, Mennonite-affiliated fellowship), this young progressive Christian isn't at all a myth. My community is full of them (us, although I'm in the 35-40 category).

I completely agree with Tyler, though. For the most part, "...these kinds of progressive young Christians...aren't at a church. They've been pushed away or at least feel pushed away." They have been inspired by the life of Christ, but they might hesitate to acknowledge that, for a variety of reasons. Reaching out to them has become a main goal for me and my husband.

[Zach]

I would agree with the point that liberally based theological views are attractive, and add that they have attracted me to churches. I definitely fit this stereotype. I am tattooed, pierced, wear thick black rimmed glasses and whatever t-shirt feels comfortable that day. I am the minority at my church, but there I have found what I suspect most people(regardless of age) are looking for. Raw uncut transparency, the truth not masked with programs or flashy spectacles to draw in the crowds. Honest heartfelt love for God, the kind that draws you to the altar in praise where you surrender all that you are for the privilege of walking with God. "Progressive" is just another attempt to make edgy what does not need to be.

[Kristin T. (@kt_writes)]

Hi, it's me again. :)

I just wanted to add that from my perspective, being socially "progressive" and biblically rooted are not mutually exclusive.

At my church, we feel our focus on issues of mercy and justice are not "hip" or "cool," but rather they stem directly from our focus on Jesus and our efforts to dig into the Bible. We believe we can’t take those teachings seriously without responding with action. This is how we meaningfully relate God’s love to the world.

[pb]

great comments Kristin.
and where are you located?
aha... the Midwest, you say?
:)
(see my earlier comment)

[Don Heatley]

This comment comes from Anna Broadway who had some technical difficulty posting a comment directly:

Having spent four years in New York and now almost three in the Bay area, I've probably had more contact with these mythic progressives. I imagine there are pockets of them in Portland and Seattle (at least at Mars Hill) as well. The thing I suspect is challenging is that, depending on how people come to such a mindset, there may be a resistance to authority (or at least certain structures) -- especially to the idea that the church has the right to have input on things like how I spend my money and what I do with my body.

As Tim Keller has noted, more-conservative cultures/communities tend to be more challenged or startled by things in the Bible that support good stewardship of the earth, social justice, etc., while more-liberal/"progressive" folks have trouble with things like the definition of sex as appropriate only with a marriage relationship. While that's obviously a simplification, I suspect that most of us -- even once we've submitted our lives to Jesus -- will tend to struggle more with one strand of teaching than the other. In some cases, that may play out in a reticence to join a community to the extent that it has a right to question some of my choices, and in others that may mean a struggle to hear out those who challenge how well the community is living out its espoused values. That's not a bad thing, though. As Keller noted elsewhere, if the Bible is the word of God, and therefore written outside all cultures, to some extent, it should be challenging to EVERY culture, though the point of difficulty will vary depending on our blind spots and particular struggles.

Which is a rambling way of saying: I wonder if "progressive" believers' struggle may be with the idea that the Bible/the church has a right to challenge some of their more cherished beliefs. If so, could this play out in hesitance to join a local church community? On a practical note: I've been in two different churches now that have augmented their weekly community groups with a short-term structure, intended for people who are new to church or the faith and reluctant of jumping into an open-ended commitment to a small group. From what I can tell, these groups (typically 4 to 6 weeks in duration, if I recall right) have been a good way to ease people into the richer community possible within the local congregation.

On the flip side, Don, it sounds like you may be facing the particular challenge of getting younger folks to think of the church as not just another group that they join (primarily as recipients of the work done by the pastors and leaders), but as a community -- a family, really -- that they are a part of and should take as much ownership in as those with formal leadership positions. I know this is something my pastors frequently try to remind us of -- that the work of the church is not just about the teaching up front, but what each and every one of us in the rows does, that we're all an equal part of it.

[Don Heatley]

Wow, I go away for a day and miss a great conversation. Thanks all of you for adding your comments. I don't think I can address each of them, although they all certainly deserve a response. If I could just summarize a few trends I see here. Obviously, there are young progressive Christians out there. Equally as obvious, it is not as common a phenomena in the Northeast.

The word progressive means something different to each of you. For some, it relates to social action. For others, theological concepts. For me, it is both and that it was I was referring to in my original post.

At Vision, we have merged a more "contemporary" form of worship while including concepts from contemporary theology. I think one usually finds one or the other. To put it generalized terms - either a church w/ a band and video screen that's all about getting into heaven or a mainline liberal church with more traditional worship. We are exploring the new territory of having a band and video, but also preaching sermons that may touch on process theology or the Girardian theory of atonement. I realize we aren't the only church doing that, but it is not that common and almost nonexistent around here.

I agree with those of you say that many young adults interested in such a community have long ago crossed church off their list as the place to find it. Most of them are completely unaware that there are a variety of theologies and ways of interpreting Scripture within the richness of Christianity. This is unfortunate to say the least.

What suggestions do you all have about connecting with people in this mindset? Not so much to get them to come to our church, but to introduce them to a relationship with Christ that doesn't necessarily include the stereotypes they reject.

Peace,
Don

[Matt]

Don,

I think it is foolish to tweak your practice and doctrine trying to connect with a certain kind of person, especially when you don't observe many of this kind of person in your community.

I think your quote from Tim Keller gets to the heart of the matter. Any person who puts their social and political opinions before the word of God is going to be shocked and offended and turned off by a church preaching and teaching the real Gospel of Christ. Some of these folks tell us they hate the churches they have known but they like the idea of Jesus. Except the Jesus that they like is something that they've created for themselves.

We cannot, we must not, preach a false gospel to appease those who are attracted to a false jesus.

I think you know you have a real Christian when you challenge their opinions and values from the standard of scripture, and they allow themselves to be transformed and changed by the word of God, rather than clinging to the values of the subculture that they are coming from.

And I write this as someone who has dropped a lot of my cherished [conservative] social and political ideas once I had a chance to examine them in the harsh light of scripture.

[Don Heatley]

Matt,
I'm not suggesting tweaking practices or beliefs to connect with a particular demographic. I am merely observing that a church authentically following where God leads them does not always connect with young adults, as much literature on the subject suggests. It's great that scripture has caused you to rethink many of your ideas. You would be surprised how uncommon that trait is among any age group.
Peace,
Don

BTW, the Keller quote came from Anna, not me.

[Matt]

Don,

Exactly, exactly, exactly!

A church authentically following where God leads them does not always connect with young adults. In my experience, such a church does not connect with the hip, cool crowd, no matter how that is defined. The Gospel speaks more clearly to the poor, the hurting, the outcast, the lonely, the messed-up people in our community. These are not attractive people and they can be difficult to deal with. Yet, the example of our Savior couldn't be stronger here.

I think both "progressive" and "conservative" can become false gospels that stand between a person and the true Gospel. When I came of age (I'm a little older), it was cool for young people in my circles to be politically conservative. Today, the young and hip are tend to be very proudly and overtly progressive. It is hard to redirect a person's allegiance to Christ when their self-image is wrapped up in their love for a political movement or leader. I think we see the same pattern in the gospels.

I shouldn't have said "you" in my first paragraph above. Its obvious that you are resisting the temptation to lust after a certain demographic. I should have put that differently. And attributed the Keller quote correctly!

[Nate]

I moved out to California (Sacramento area) from Kansas City a year ago, and my experience is, like pb says above, that things are much MORE polarized here than they were in Kansas City. You're either conservative/evangelical or liberal/mainline, with all the stereotypes that go along with that.

I'm one of those elusive under-35 emergent types, though I don't know if "progressive" is the word I would use, since I associate that with a particular political stance. And my life with Christ is far more than a political ideology.

Unfortunately--for the purpose of adding anything to this discussion, that is--I grew up going to church and never really walked away. I have yet to figure out what my never-churched counterparts really think about Jesus or the church or spirituality in general; I can't think of a common thread in my non-Christian friends. It is hard to hope that many of them will ever come to faith in Jesus. The only place I know how to start is from my own story, when I finally came to the end of my own ability and realized that only God could re-make me.

I like the part in Donald Miller's book "Blue Like Jazz," when he tells of the conversation he has with his atheist friend. She says she doesn't believe in God, but does believe in sin.

I don't see how anyone would want to know Jesus unless they see an insufficiency in themselves. And yet, at the same, time, I believe the way of Jesus is not to condemn but to love. I think many of the gimmicks that churches use to attract people are fundamentally about a lack of faith: faith that the Spirit will draw people to God, faith that love and only love is all that God calls us do to.